Bug with PSE 3 backup to DVD on Windows

I converted from PSA 2 to PSE 3. Things seemed to be fine so I decided now was a good time to back things up.

I went to File->Backup, walked through things to do a full backup. I chose my DVD burner, it told me that it was going to take 4 discs. Everything's ok so far.

I'm prompted to insert disc 1. I do. A new window appears and it writes to the DVD at about the expected write rate. It prompts me to verify. I say yes (why isn't there a always say yes option?).

I'm prompted to insert disc 2. I do. In less than a minute, it claims it is done. This seems bad. I'm asked to verify. I say yes. It says it verified. This seems VERY bad.

I'm prompted to insert disc 3. It works (behaves like what happened with disc 1).

I'm prompted to insert disc 4. It fails like disc 2.

At the end, it says that I'm all backed up.

However, I don't believe it so I look at the discs. Only disc 1 and disc 3 (the ones where it spend time writing) have viewable data on them. disc 2 and 4 are unreadable by Windows.

I do a backup to a hard disk directory, just in case the estimate was off and it only needed 2 discs and not 4. Nope, the directory size ends up being 30GB and now I'm even more confused as that should then require 7 DVDs and not 4.

Anyone else see this?

There might a reason for this, as backup aren't always of the same format as
the media from which they come. Sometimes, manufacturers will use a
propreitary format, which permits to store more info, but makes the disk
unreadable by Windows. It's what's happening, for example, with Veritas
Backup My PC software. It creates disk that are unreadable by Windows.

However, in this particular case, I'd call this... a serious issue! Post a
report at this link (I can't tell if Adobe will look at it, though, I don't
work for them).

http://www.adobe.com/misc/bugreport.html

Ray

PSA/PSE is certainly supposed to write normal iso CDs, no proprietary file system!

After all the bad experiences with PSA 2 and backups, I'd recommend you use PSE backup to a folder on your hard drive and let your "normal" burning software copy this to DVD.

Do file a bug report though!

Alexander.
--
1533 MHz, 1 GB, XP SP2, Canon Ixus 430 (aka S410), CanoScan D1250U2F, German PSE v2.0.2 + PSA v2.0.1 (PSE v3 + PrE v1 soon to come)

FWIW, I reported this as a bug before I posted to this forum. However, the bug reporting form gave enough warnings about how the bug may be ignored that I decided to post here as well.

I have a very similar problem:

I'm trying to make my first full backup to DVD-R, I have 6500+ photos, PSE says it will take 4 DVDs. The problem is that disk one "burns" in about a second, and "Verifies" in about 1 second -- No data is written to the disk. I cancelled the backup at that point.

For what it's work, PSA 2.0 backed things up flawlessly on this system.

(HP Pavillion ze5300 with firewire attached TDK 440N).

I'm having the same problem. Has anyone found a solution yet?

Same 1 second burn here with a Sony DRU-510A DVD drive.

Just like to add to the list, I have the exact sme problem. First DVD written and verified correctly, second DVD written and verified almost immediately, so nothing on it, third DVD okay again! Hope someone has a solution or a patch can be provided. DVD writter is a Matshita UJ-812.

David.

Hi David,

Obviously a serious problem here.

Is anyone else seeing this?

Again, have you tried other DVD (e.g., DVD+R, or +/- RW) if your drive allows? How about decreasing burn speeds. As a last resort has anyone tried burning to CD-RW instead? (I realize this would be rather inconvenient given the catalog sizes mentioned here, but it still may be worth investigating. I'm suspecting this will work as the total required disc calculation will be different). Has this only been seen using DVD?

I presume burning otherwise works normally on your machine outside of PSE v3.0? Does restarting the PSE application, or restarting the Burn/Backup Wizard change the result?

What kinds of files do you have in your Catalog? Large sized files (e.g., 100MB TIF file, etc.)? DOES THIS PROBLEM DISAPPEAR WITH THE ADDITION OR SUBTRACTION OF FILES TO/FROM THE CATALOG? Perhaps try a few of the the larger ones first...

Any further clues you can provide without too much energy expense on your part would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

-=Michael

Michael,

I'd like to mention again that doing a backup to a disk directory worked fine.

I'd also like to point out an annoyance where when you are burning to DVD, you need to click verify after each disk. It'd be really good to have an option where you always verify. That way, I can just stick in a disk and not have to check back on it so frequently.

For what it is worth, I'm using a Pioneer DVR-106D burning to 4x DVD-R media (Digital Matrix Dataguard). My machine is a P4 3.2Ghz w/1GB memory running Windows XP SP2. Burning other stuff works fine. I didn't try this again after the bad burn.

It seems like with the every other disc problem that some variable isn't being properly reset when the dialog box pops up and so it doesn't actually do the work to burn to the media and the fact that it verifies ok.

Walter

Hi Walter,

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Just quickly, I did encounter this issue over the weekend, and I will continue to investigate.

I have approximately 2990 items in my Catalog.

I first attempted a Full Backup to my external USB 2.0 Pioneer DVR-A06U to a used Imation DVD+RW disc. I select this particular disc drive in Burn/Backup Wizard Step 3, which once selected also identifies the 2.4x burn speed and 4530.40MB size. I'm alerted that 2 discs are necessary. When I click [Done] the burn progress indicator never reaches 1% (i.e., stays at zero) as previously described here. I canceled the second disc to view the items in Windows that appear to have been burned to the DVD. In exploring this disc I find that although it appears the disc it full of items (which, of course is impossible) only about the first 7 items can actually be viewed by an external viewer.

I repeated this test with a different disc (i.e., new Memorex DVD-RW 2.0x) and got the same failure. I suspect this then is not related to DVD disc type, burn speed, or burn hardware.

BTW - My second disc when completed is only 60MB...but, this is 5 files sized, 20MB TIF, 17.1MB TIF, 5.50MB TIF, 17.4MB TIF, and a 308KB Backup.tly. I noticed the 17.1MB file was partially corrupted when opened in an external viewer. Some of these files also were from Stacks and Version Sets.

I understand that there are reasons the full 4.7 GB capacity is not used for the available DVD. Perhaps there could be an error in the logic that determines the total number of discs, and which items go to which disc (i.e, not for ALL backups, but rather for those backups where large files fall on either side of this equation).

-=Michael

Has everyone that has seen this only have one hard drive, with no partitions? That is, are all your files stored on C:\ where your application is installed?

Because of the DVD failure I backed up to disk (USB removeable drive). I then restored to different hardware - where once the Catalog is restored I cannot recreate the issue.

Still trying...

Thanks,

-=Michael

Still trying...

Michael,

Nope, three hard drives and four partitions. The catalog is on E:\ which is on the same drive as C:\. I also just moved the catalog (and pictures) to a network drive but haven't tried to backup since then.

I believe I tried to upgrade from Photoshop Album 2.0. However, I think I tossed that catalog since I couldn't get the pictures reattached and decided I'd rather start over from scratch.

Walter

Hi Walter,

Thanks very much for the help!

If I follow, your catalog and install are on the same physical drive, but different partitions (i.e., E:\ and C:\ respectively). This is similar to my setup (C:\ and D:\).

Did you use File > Move to move your files to the network drive? If you have available drive space on one of the other partitions you could try those as well (perhaps this is more practical than the Network drive?). I'd be very curious to know whether your DVD Backup works now that these files have been "moved", or rewritten to another partition/drive.

Thanks much!

-=Michael

As a brief experiment I increased the size of my home catalog where I have encountered this issue. I simply included a 70 MB .wmv file.

Again, I selected my Pioneer drive (above) in Burn/Backup Wizard Step 3, which once selected now identifies a 2.0x burn speed and 4604.50MB (up from the previous 4530.40MB size). I'm alerted that 2 discs are still necessary. When I click [Done] the burn progress indicator does not reach 1%. However, this time it appears the second disc also does not burn correctly.

-=Michael

The solution I worked out for this problem was to upgrade my firmware. I have a Sony DRU 710A and had these same issues. The hardware upgrade solved this problem totally. <http://sony.storagesupport.com/dvdrw/dru710adwn.htm>
Hope this helps.

Perry

Thank you, Perry! :)

Unfortunately, a firmware upgrade for my Pioneer drive has not fixed the problem.

-=Michael

Perry,

I am running the most current version of the firmware (just double checked).

In any event, I would expect that if the firmware were the problem then the verification would fail instead of saying ok.

My expectation is that the burn process would involve:
1. Generate the list of files to back up.
2. Get the size of the backup media
3. Divide the numbers above and decide how many pieces of media you'll need. I presume this could be smart and try to convserve media since it appears the backup is file based or it could just go through and go up until it would exceed the size of the media and then go to the next one.
4. For each media, write out the files to the DVD and then verify by reading the data off the DVD and then either comparing it to the file or perhaps a MD5 checksum of the file.

By the fact that it is writing out to some disks (and saying it verified ok) and not writing out to others (but still saying it is ok), implies to me that there is a bug where the data to be written out is set at some zero or negative value -- otherwise, it shouldn't verify that the data was successfully written.

I have the same Issues as Walter. Is there any fix anyone has found.

Terry
AMD643500+
LG 4163B burner

Just joined this forum...

I have been able to successfully backup my catalog to 2 DVDs using PSE 3.0. One time I had a problem writing to the second DVD (the same "2-second write" described above). I simply tried it again from scratch and it worked.

Now, however, every time I try, I get the same "2-second write" and I cannot get the backup to work again. I have not changed any hardware or drivers.

My catalog AND all of my image files reside on the same (E:) partition.

I use 4x DVD-R media.

Hope this helps someone find a solution.

I have the same problem and sometimes I don't. It occurs when I try to burn to dvd-r and it works when I try to burn to dvd+rw.

I have two drives with pix on both drives.
I have a sony dru-500ax (firmware up to date)

Carson

Hi All...

I'll see what sort of feeback from Adobe I can get on this issue. It is the weekend however... so please be patient.

Cheers

Hello all,

I too just joined this forum. I am not exactly experiencing the same issues. My process is to back up my video files (avi) to dvd as a cataloguing and archiving process using PSE3. Until this weekend everything was going fine. Except a couple of times, where I know it will take 3 to 4 DVD's to accomplish the task, PSE3 would say it takes one disc. I have usually just canceled, shut down the program and relaunch with success.

The issue I have with backing up the files is that I know my burner is able to handle 4X speed, but the back up software (SONIC?) will only allow me 2.3x. Is there something in PSE3 I need to set to change this?

Bob

Same here on two different computers. Totally maddening. Two different catalogs, two different setups and different burners (Plextor and brand new NEC). That Plextor 708a worked in an old box burning a catalog backup so I can say for sure it is NOT a firmware issue in any way. Throwing it in a different box and suddenly I can a 10 second burn?

This is an ugly, ugly bug. Going to try saving as a new catalog file. Really wish Adobe would say SOMETHING.

Hi Benjamin,

I agree this issue is ugly. I shall continue to run tests and provide more feedback in the coming week. Based on your above post we still can not yet rule out hardware (e.g., firmware update), nor Backup software.

I would first advise anyone encountering this issue to acquire the latest firmware update for their optical drive. Including such detail in Forum posts would continue to be very helpful.

FYI - importing the very same files into a New Catalog sans tags, etc., did not change my Backup result.

In the meantime, those looking desperately to Backup can backup to disk, preferably an external hard disk, or parition. To be clear, I'm not by any means suggesting this as a long term option.

I can assure you that despite this issue being seen by a very low percentage of users I am doing everything I can to see that this issue gets the much needed attention it deserves.

Thanks for your patience, talk soon...

-=Michael

Another data point: I'm seeing this behavior after I installed a brand new Pioneer DVR-A09XLA burner in a Dell Dimension 8200 (Pentium 4 1.9GHz, 512MB RAM, Windows XP Professional SP2), using FujiFilm 8x DVD-R media. I updated the DVD burner firmware from 1.09 to 1.17 and still see the same behavior. I have 11000 images (>21GB) in my catalog, all on the same drive.

What really worries me is how can "Verify" return without errors so quickly? Somehow I can believe that writing would fail without reporting errors, but how could "Verify" possibly "succeed"?

I installed the DVD burner specifically to back them up, so I wouldn't need to use 30+ CD-Rs to do the job. My backup hard drive has started to die, so hopefully someone can find the problem soon!

Just to pile on (in case Adobe thinks this is "only a few isolated instances") I had the same problem, with no sensible response from customer support. I've written this off as one of several things that don't work in PSE3, and I use Roxio CD/DVD creator for backups - I had to grope a bit to find where the catalog files were stored, but it works! The maddening thing about the PSE3 bug is that it does ruin the DVDs, even if there is nothing worthwhile written on them!

Neil

Hi All,

I've since tested three different burners with my Catalog. In one case I had the seconds burn result. The burn process appears to have started in that my finished disc has about 8 items I may actually open in Windows.

The other two burners produced what appeared to be working pairs of discs, only to find I get the "Error encountered while restoring Catalog" when attempting to Restore to another system. Further investigation finds that the .buc file on disc 1 will not copy to disk in Windows. All other disc items appear present and functional in Windows.

This issue is not specific to Backup, as I was able to reproduce this seconds behavior using File > Burn - Copy. Is anyone else seeing this?

This issue still occurs regardless of DVD media (i.e., -R, +R, +RW, -RW), and at least in the case of my Pioneer DVR-A06U drive also continues to fail after a firmware update.

Importing these same images into a new Catalog also produced the same result.

Growing the catalog simply by adding items was also not helpful.

Can someone experiencing this issue please tell me a little about their Catalog? I'd be interested in knowing what kind of large files are present. My Catalog is only unique in that it is reasonably large (i.e., approximately 3500 items), and has several large files (e.g., 60-80MB tifs, 50MB movies, etc), and resides on a partition.

Again, anyone see this with CDs?

Thanks very much for your help in this matter,

-=Michael

The issue doesn't appear to be specific to burner, or media type, though a particular combination of the two may yield a different result depending on the hardware. Having finally recreated the seconds burn issue moving my Catalog from hard disk to another system and then trying the backup procedure from this new hardware, this would seem to indicate something unique about my catalog (note: keep in mind I did not recreate the issue when using these exact same files sans tags in a new Catalog). A combination of Catalog contents, media, and hardware would seem to point to our Third Party software. There is complexity here, and I appreciate your patience.

I also encountered what may be a related issue in that I was able to successfully burn to disc with this same Catalog and yet found disc one would not Restore due to the .buc file being corrupt on disc one. Again, this despite verification. I would be interested in knowing if anyone else has witnessed "Error encountered while restoring Catalog" and then checked their disc one contents in Windows and found the .buc file could not simply be copied (e.g., from disc to Desktop).

I had previously recommended CD-R as a potential option, though I've now seen this fail too. For example, my Pioneer DVR-A06U with the latest firmware update failed using CD-R following try to DVD - & + RW. I then switched to my internal Sony IDE CD-RW and burned 11 discs that I was able to successfully Restore to another system. So it is possible to still have success with CD-R as a temporary option, with the best solution at the moment a write to an external hard drive. Not proposing this as a permanent solution, and doing my best to get this issue resolved.

Thanks very much for your input!

-=Michael

Michael,

What if you make a new thread for the contents of your post today and use a thread title like "Adobe requesting user feeback on problems with backup to DVD" ? Suggest that you place the new thread in the ELEMENTS 3 ORGANIZER subforum.

I think that might call more attention to your request.

I vaguely recollect that some people on the forum did get error messages like "not a valid backup set" when trying to do a restore from a backup to DVD. Seemm like such a message could result from a problem with the .buc file - but that is just a guess on my part. Perhaps you would find more in a forum search as those participatns may not be currently reading the forum and see your request for information.

I have backed up a catalog to 2 CDs and restored on a different computer. However, generally I use an external hard drive for backups, so I can't give you any relevant info.

Barb Olson

Hi,

Thank you, Barb :)

Done.

-=Michael

I have the same problem. A full catalog backup requests 4 DVD discs. The burn of disc 1 takes place instantly (the burn light on the DVD never comes on). Amazingly, it verifies the disc. Then the next 3 discs backup properly. I updated the firmware with no change. I'm trying the external drive cure next. But you can't expect everyone to have an external drive.

Based on other problems I've had with Elements 3 with CD/DVD burning, my GUESS is that there is a conflict with some other software installed on the computer. But what?

Hi Ira,

Would you mind posting your details to

Michael Sobieski, "Adobe requesting feedback on "Seconds" burn to disc (only)" #, 11 Apr 2005 7:46 am </cgi-bin/webx?50@@.3bb9b081>

?

Thanks very much, :)

-=Michael